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Check out this site and my comments lifted from a recent Facebook debate:

http://www.attackproof.com/the-myth-of-grappling-as-self-defense.html

My Comments:

To be honest mate I agree with a lot of this, the usual well-rehearsed stuff verging on stating the bleeding obvious such as try to avoid going to ground, no multiple attackers in the ring/cage, no weapons defences in MMA/BJJ etc but overall the tone was informed by the unnecessary feud in the USA between the Reality Systems and the MMA/BJJ camp. Take this as an example:

“A well known competitor (not in one of the legitimate judo, boxing, karate, kickboxing, or wrestling arts, but in this wonderful “system” that has been brought to us by the great masters from South America;land of machismo) starts a fight with someone!”

Petulant and with a bit of quasi-racism as well. Could this be motivated by the genuine and legitimate financial competition posed to Reality systems by MMA/BJJ? He uses bullshit terms like “Genuine Warrior” as well. Really, unless you are talking about Wishbone Ash albums from the 1970s, do not use the word “Warrior” ever.

Onto more substantial issues. Sometimes going to ground can be fine, e.g. if up against a bigger, stronger and younger guy an aggressive take down followed by a quick break or strike can be very handy. Most people don’t know how to fall so you can at least buy some time this way as he recovers from the impact of the fall. Weight advantage? our friend on these pages, Stephen Cole, is a big 20 stone muscular unit, I am a wiry 13 stone and getting on a bit: I’ll take my chances taking the guy down on my terms and ending up in the dominant position every time against trading toe-to toe with a gentleman that size who knows how to hit. And don’t rely on groin strikes: they don’t always work immediately and often you don’t have the room to get in a good kick. Against multiple attackers? You can effect aggressive takedowns which do not involve you going to ground and really screw the guy upwhen he hits the deck, not a bad option as it at least takes one guy out and buys some time.

You need to have a ground game to learn how to defend yourself on the floor, if anybody says all you need to do is bite, gouge, squeeze bollocks etc. then walk out of the class.
A good groundfighter will easily avoid and neutralise these defences, if you don’t believe me then try 2 minutes on the floor with my partner Leo Negao.

A lot of the Reality Systems teach basic defences on the floor but do not have a “Plan B” i.e. what to do if the guy knows what he is doing and defends your initial response. There are increasing numbers of accomplished groundfighters out there and not all of them are nice guys as Steiner suggests. (though some complete wankers do Reality systems as well, they are not all Genuine Warriors, or Wishbone Ash fans) and to counter them you need to know what their game is. This is also true of takedown defences: you need to known how to do a decent takedown before you can defend one properly in my view.

As Reality teachers we need to avoid people getting to wrapped up in the aesthetic of the groundfight so after being taken down we give guys 5 seconds to either tap out the aggressor or get up safely, if not they get a gentle toeing from the other guys in the group until they get up. Focuses the mind and teaches the right skills.

See below re how one of our guys got on against some very nasty attackers. He did fantastically well but there are some important lessons to be had here in my view:

1.be very careful if you’re wearing gold these days – the price is high and gangs of thugs are out there specifically looking for gold. South Asian women are particularly vulnerable;

2. a lot of these thugs carry knives, if you have to fight them you must destroy with extreme prejudice and disengage very quickly;

3. fighting multiple attackers is damned tough, cover your head as best you can, create distance between you and the bad guys, make sure you can see them and try to get them in a line so they get in each others’ way. All easier said than done, particularly in this environment, best rule is to Avoid;

4. don’t screw with UKM people.

Below are some kind words unedited from one of our new students on how he defended himself against a nasty confrontation.

An Urban Krav Maga and Mark O’Neil testimonial:

After having attended Sussex Urban Krav Maga for 4-5 weeks I was mugged at UKF bass culture (a London music event at Alexandra Palace) on the 25th of November. The techniques I had learnt even in this short period undoubtedly protected me and prevented a severe beating as suffered by others targeted during the same evening by the same gang – here are the details of what occurred:

10 000 people attended the event and the incident occurred during Nero’s set, so the arena was packed tight with people, it was dark lights were flashing and the music was incredibly loud, unbeknownst to me the gang of 5 were pointing out their targets and pushing through the crowd until they were surrounding them, one directly behind and the other four within one or two people on all sides. I was wearing a gold chain given to me as a special gift for my 18th birthday – a silly choice given the escalated price of gold and the nature of the event – but something I’ve worn every day since receiving it so I didn’t think! This was the gang’s target and many other people outside when I went out after were reporting chains being snatched.
The lad who had moved directly behind me grabbed the chain, I felt this and began to turn to my right straight away, he turned to run away into the crowd as his hand pulled on the chain to snap it, as the chain gave way his right hand was to the right of my neck because I had turned, I grabbed over his knuckles with my left hand, twisted sharply outwards and pulled his arm towards me – as per a knife to the neck from the rear drill from the class. This flung him to the floor and left him lying on his back, head at my feet and legs away from me – looking shocked. Had it just have been him I would have very easily managed to take my necklace back and prevent him from following me using any of the finishing techniques we had practiced – however I then got punched in the side of the head from my right. I let go of the first lad who I had thrown to the floor and turned to the directing of the punch realising there was another person involved to my right, he swung again and I had already adopted the rhino defence as we were told that if there were multiple assailants or when a punch was being thrown that the best way to protect your head was to adopt this defence. I drove towards him with my elbow up and his punch went behind me, his right arm colliding with my left, when I felt this collision I opened up and grabbed behind his head in a muay thai style clinch, I pulled his head down and kneed him to the forehead sending him falling into the crowd, I was then punched in the back of the head by a third attacker his punch connected hard and his hand slid past my right ear, I rotated to my left quickly and threw a punch as I turned – connecting well with his jaw and knocking him unconscious to the floor. By this time a 6ft circle had appeared in the crowd inside in which only me and the remaining boys were left the first lad I had thrown had got up and run, the remaining two pushed me across this circle from behind and ran away into the crowd leaving me and the unconscious lad in the circle – I shouted loudly after them words to the effect of “come on then I’ll have you” to ensure that they wouldn’t come back and then turned my attention to the lad lying face down to my left, he was lying face down and was beginning to stir, I jumped on his back and pulled his right arm out and behind him – I bent his wrist and locked his arm behind him as shown to us in the class, picked him up to his feet and walked him 30meters to the side of the venue where the security were. I explained that him and four other lads had just mugged me and he was escorted to the front door where he was handed over to the police – upon searching him the police found 4 mobile phones and 6 wallets in his possession and he was arrested.
Several other people outside also identified him as one of the muggers that had attacked them – however most of the lads outside had extremely swollen faces, bleeding lips and signs of having sustained a lot more damage – one lad described them snatching his chain he turned to grab it back and was then beaten to the floor and had his wallet and mobile taken – this left me certain that had I not acted in the way I had and known how to act I would have suffered a similar fate – unfortunately I did not manage to recover my chain and as the police were unwilling to enter the event or stay until it closed they did not catch the other participants – I did however report the crime and was able to give full descriptions of all involved.

Had I not attended Sussex Urban Krav Maga – I would not have been able to bring the first mugger to the floor, I would not have been able to defend myself against, or distance myself from, the second mugger, I would not have turned to strike the third mugger I would have definitely just attempted to hit the floor to get out of trouble – as per the other victims of this group. In short I would have lost my mobile, wallet and keys as well as my necklace, I would have sustained a lot more physical damage and I definitely would not have managed to get one of them arrested or have been able to describe or identify any of the gang – I think everyone can benefit from knowing how to react in these situations, I strongly believe that knife defence is something everyone should learn and having even the smallest amount of knowledge and practice made a huge difference for me.
Thanks and kind regards
JP

Here is the endorsement:

“Mr. John Lacy has introduced me to a world of discipline and self confidence that has only added to the foundation that my 20 year career in federal law enforcement has given me. John is a patient, knowledgeable, and motivational instructor that truly enjoys what he does and encourages the entire Urban Krav Maga class to perform to the best of their abilities. If you’re looking for a Cardio-Kickboxing class, keep looking because UKM is not the place for you. If you’re looking for a system that gets you in great shape and provides you with the physical and mental tools to keep you and your family safe, then please give it a try, you won’t be disappointed.”

Jack L.

Punching to the “boney” parts of the head is never a good idea, especially if you know how to strike: you will hurt your knuckles. You get more range with a punch and, all else remaining equal, cause more damage to the face; however most real fights occur at close distance so range isn’t really an issue. Beware of hammer fists as well: it just takes a small error in technique or the guy to move in a way that you don’t expect and you have a screwed up little finger or damaged bone in the back of the hand, best leave this for the ring as well.

I continue to teach punching techniques because most guys will revert to punching when under pressure, particularly when in a “mob v mob” fight with multiple participants, and I figure that they need to know how to throw a punch properly but it is not encouraged, not at all.

Adrian raised an interesting point about why many systems teach a strong closed fist. Many factors here.

Some of the better know Reality Systems are basically kickboxing/Thai disciplines with some weapons/groundwork appended, some of the weapons techniques are extensions of kickboxing.

Many martial arts were brought to the West through contacts with the East after the end of WW2. Re karate, I’m not sure the Okinawans taught the Japanese the real stuff as they were their conquerors, and I’m not sure the Japanese taught the real stuff to the Americans as they were their conquerors. Things have developed from that flawed starting point and competition has compounded the problem as the additional range acquired through punching is very helpful in this context. Now, this is just my attempt at answering Adrian’s question and I’m not dissing any style, just trying to explain the origins of a big issue for Reality Systems.

Need to remember too that punching is a highly non-leveraged technique. I used to work in a style that recommended against a knife threat to the front that the defender grab the knife holding wrist, move to the side and punch the attacker in the face before disarming. Was never keen on this technique as it’s pretty tough to generate a lot of punching power close in and one night at class we had a 15 stone Thai boxer with a neck the size of thigh partnered up against a lady of about 7 stone and tiny hands; absurd for her to even attempt the technique described above so we developed another response which you can look at here if you’re interested:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ijqrCN0o240

Coming to understand more and more that it is like a game of physical chess and this determines how you teach it. There are apparently a few million potential moves in every chess game; maybe not so many in a groundfight but there are still many potential combinations of attack/counter attack with varying degrees of complexity.

You can’t teach a Chess student every potential move but you can give the bases, the building blocks of strategy, defence, attack, positioning for the counter-attack, containment etc. They will need to develop.and perfect these skills in an actual chess match with a non-co-operative opponent. Mutatis mutandis, the same applies to the ground-fighting game, you can give the tools but students need to perfect their application in a nice ground-fight, with punching etc. allowed of course, with this being UKM.

And after that use of Latin in the previous paragraph, let me just revert to type and say that if anybody tells you that if it  goes to ground all you need is to be able to bite, headbutt and eye-gouge your way out of trouble, they are talking bollocks and should spend 2 minutes on the floor with a semi – accomplished grappler to test their theory.